💥 Uncompromising Truth: Gary Yourofsky on Speciesism, Masculinity, and the Ethical Imperative to Go Vegan

The Unapologetic Voice of Animal Rights

In the realm of animal rights activism, few figures are as polarizing or as impactful as Gary Yourofsky. Known for his viral lectures—often hailed as "The Most Important Speech You Will Ever Hear"—Yourofsky has spent decades challenging deeply ingrained societal norms with an uncompromising, ethical truth. He argues that the move to veganism is not merely a health choice, but a fundamental moral imperative.

In a recent, powerful discussion on the Real Men Eat Plants podcast, Yourofsky didn't hold back, diving deep into the brutal realities of the animal agriculture industry. He laid out a stark vision where compassion, not consumption, defines true strength. If you’ve ever wondered about the core injustice at the heart of our diet, or how to advocate for animals with genuine strength, his insights are essential. This post unpacks his core arguments, including his definition of speciesism and the most effective ways to accelerate the decline of the trillion-dollar animal exploitation industry.

1. Defining the Core Injustice: Why Speciesism is the Truest Form of Racism

Gary Yourofsky's entire philosophy is built upon the rejection of a single, pervasive prejudice: speciesism.

What is Speciesism?

Speciesism, as defined by Yourofsky, is a form of discrimination analogous to racism and sexism, where one group (the human species) considers itself superior to all others. This perceived superiority is then used to justify the exploitation of other species.

"Just like racism, the human species thinks they're more special, more important than all the other species. So when we say that animals are food, clothing, research specimens, and entertainment when we exploit them... we're committing acts of speciesism."

Yourofsky elevates this concept further, asserting that what humans do to animals is the truest form of racism—a human race versus animal race dynamic. The victims, like all oppressed groups, are denied the simple pursuit of life, liberty, and happiness.

The Holocaust and Slavery Analogy: An Uncomfortable Truth

One of the most controversial and, for many, life-altering aspects of Yourofsky’s message is his unapologetic comparison of factory farming practices to human atrocities, specifically the Holocaust and slavery.

When challenged, Yourofsky offers a devastating numerical and ethical perspective:

• The Scale of Suffering: He points out that if you remove the human victims from a concentration camp and replace them with cows, pigs, or chickens, the structure remains a place of murderous demise.

• A World’s Biggest Holocaust: Yourofsky states that a number of animals equal to the 6 million victims of the Jewish Holocaust die globally in the time it takes to utter the phrase "6 million Jews". In just two weeks, the number of oppressed, raped, and murdered non-human animals surpasses all recorded human atrocities since the beginning of time. * Baby Stealing as the Worst Atrocity: For Yourofsky, the routine act of baby stealing in the dairy and egg industries—forcibly separating mothers from their offspring—is now a worse atrocity than the slaughter itself. This practice is a direct parallel to the horrors of human slavery, where a slave owner thought they owned the child born to a enslaved person.

He argues that for anyone to be offended by these comparisons is "egotistical, arrogant, close-minded and outrageous," because it implies a hierarchy of suffering, when "all injustices are bad".

2. Redefining Masculinity: Compassion as True Strength

The hosts of Real Men Eat Plants asked Yourofsky to address the persistent social stereotype that veganism is "effeminate" or for the "weak." His response is a powerful redefinition of masculinity rooted in protection and moral courage.

A Real Man Protects the Weak

Yourofsky dismantles the notion that a real man eats meat to be strong. Instead, he flips the script: A real man protects those who are weaker than they are.

"A real man does not take advantage, does not violate somebody that is weaker than they are, a real man would protect those who are weaker than they are."

He uses his own experience and physique as a shield against the stereotype, noting that he deliberately worked out to maintain a physique that challenged the "weak vegan" narrative. He cites numerous examples of badass vegan athletes—fighters like James Wilkes and the Diaz brothers, and strongmen like Patrick Baboumian and Avi Lainey—as living proof that plant-based living is compatible with peak physical strength. Even Novak Djokovic, a raw vegan, has been the "baddest dude ever" in tennis.

Intimidation and Accountability

Yourofsky's confrontational style in lectures and protests was a strategic use of "masculinity" to put the spotlight on the hypocrisy of the "tough guy" meat-eater.

• He deliberately chose a stance of intimidation, knowing that "bullies hate to be bullied".

• His refusal to be cowed by police, students, or even 25 aggressive hunters was his way of demonstrating that true courage lies in defending the defenseless, even at personal risk.

• His core message to non-vegans is one of accountability: "Look me in the eyes and tell me one of two things. You don't give a shit or you're too lazy to change." This direct challenge cuts through the rationalizations (protein, taste, tradition) and forces an ethical reckoning.

3. The Path to Victory: The Economic Vulnerability of Animal Agriculture

The most critical question for any activist movement is: How do we win? Yourofsky believes the greatest strategic vulnerability of the animal agriculture industry is economic. This trillion-dollar machine is built on profit, and the most powerful action any individual can take is to dismantle it through their purchasing power.

Reduce the Demand

Yourofsky rejects the idea of directly changing the minds of corporate giants like Tyson or McDonald’s; they are driven by profit, not ethics. The battle must be won at the consumer level: reduce the demand.

• Voting with Your Wallet: The single, most immediate, non-negotiable action any person can take is to stop financially supporting the animal industries. This is the supply-and-demand dynamic at work.

• Support Vegan Alternatives: When consumers buy plant-based options—whether from a vegan-owned company or a mainstream one (like Dean Foods buying Silk Soy Milk)—they are sending an unmistakable economic signal. Every purchase of a vegan item, even at a non-vegan restaurant, pushes the business toward a vegan future. "We're gonna convert McDonald's over," he states.

The Lie of "Taste"

Yourofsky debunks the common excuse of taste by pointing out that meat doesn’t taste good; the preparation tastes good.

"The only way your meat tastes good is because you put my plants on it."

We rely on plant-derived seasonings, spices, oils, and sauces to make animal flesh palatable. An uncooked, unseasoned piece of animal flesh is universally unappealing, proving that the human palate is naturally drawn to the plant kingdom.

4. The Power of Sanctuary: Witnessing the Garden of Eden

For Yourofsky, the connection to the animals themselves is not just an intellectual exercise; it is the emotional fuel for the fight. This connection is most powerfully experienced at an animal sanctuary.

Sasha Farm Animal Sanctuary

Yourofsky has a deep, 30-year relationship with Sasha Farm Animal Sanctuary in Michigan, describing it as the "Garden of Eden"—a paradise where animals live as individuals with names, not numbers.

• Individual Recognition: Sanctuaries offer the vital experience of meeting cows, pigs, chickens, and turkeys face-to-face, realizing they are as individual, sentient, and deserving of life as the dogs and cats we adore.

• The Defense Mechanism: He argues that the negative way society views farmed animals ("them," "it") is a defense mechanism created to justify their exploitation and murder.

• A Call to Support: Sanctuaries around the world are struggling and rely on vegans and the open-minded for support. Yourofsky urges people to tithe their money to sanctuaries like Sasha Farm (SashaFarm.org) rather than religious institutions, and to donate their time to help. He highlights the irony of those who call a sanctuary a "prison" because the only reason there are fences is to protect the rescued animals from being killed by the very society that questions their freedom.

The Path to Action

Gary Yourofsky’s message is challenging, but ultimately one of empowerment: we all have the capacity for compassion and the power to end the world’s largest atrocity.

His successful conversion rate—at least 15-20% and sometimes up to 50% in his lectures—proves that a hard, uncompromising truth is often the most effective form of activism. Whether you are planting a seed or delivering the final blow to someone's cognitive dissonance, every action matters.

Your Non-Negotiable Call to Action:

For the man convicted to act right now, Yourofsky has two immediate, non-negotiable steps:

1. Watch the Truth: Dedicate 70 minutes to watching the Georgia Tech speech (search "Gary Yourofsky Georgia Tech speech" on YouTube), or the documentary Earthlings. One of these should be enough to put you on the path to ethical living.

2. Go Vegan Immediately: Stop financially supporting the abuse by removing all animal products from your body and your home. If the immediate change is too overwhelming, start small: "make Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday all vegan day" and add a day each week until you are 100% vegan.

True strength is built on truth and courage. It is time to be a real man and stand up for those who need your protection.

👉 Listen now at Real Men Eat Plants

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Episode’s Transcript

Please understand that a transcription service provided the transcript below. It undoubtedly contains errors that invariably take place in voice transcriptions.

Bryan (00:01.212)

Everybody welcome to the real men eat plants podcast. Today we are not pulling any punches. Our guest is arguably one of the most famous and certainly the most controversial voice in the modern animal rights movement. We're here to talk about the brutal truth of where our food comes from and why, in my opinion, real strength lies in facing that truth. Please welcome the unapologetic Gary Yourofsky. Thank you for being here, Gary.

Bruce Da Silva (00:25.41)

Monday.

gary yourofsky (00:29.222)

What's up, everybody? Or as they say in Detroit, what up, dope?

Bryan (00:34.804)

There we go. I love it Gary for listeners that may have not come across one of your Millions of viral videos all over the internet that are new to your work your shift to activism wasn't about like health It was really this moral conviction Can you just help set the stage for the listeners that are new tuning in like what moment crystallized your move from animal lover to radical advocate here and

Bruce Da Silva (00:35.022)

Thank

Bryan (01:02.482)

you know, you're central to your methods is this concept of speciesism. How do you define this core injustice for someone who's never heard the term?

gary yourofsky (01:10.79)

So first of all, knows the terms racism, sexism, heterosexism, classism, where one group thinks they're more special than the other group. And when you have that dynamic, there's always one group that's going to suffer because the other group thinks they're more special. So just like racism, the human species thinks they're more special, more important than all the other species. So when we say that animals are food,

clothing, research specimens, and entertainment when we exploit them. When we think that we own them, we're committing acts of speciesism. And I'll even take it a step further when we talk about racism. I think the truest form of racism is what humans do the animals to. It's not just the species, it's the human race versus the animal race. So this is real racism, this is racism, this is speciesism.

And there's no justification for it. There's no justification for one group thinking they're more special than the other group when all groups want life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. And that's all vegans are asking meat, dairy, and egg eaters to do is to step off your mountain, step off your high and mighty mountain, and extend some simple decency to the animals that you share this planet with. And I don't understand the defiance.

that meat, and egg eaters put up when we're asking them to be kind to somebody else. Seriously, what do you have to lose? Thinking that you're so special? Thinking that you're not that important? Who cares about being more important? I'm more concerned about justice, and I know you three guys are the same, and all vegans are the same. We're concerned about equality, kindness, and compassion, and not being involved in exploitation. So from the beginning, it was always ethical for me when I went to the slaughterhouse.

Bruce Da Silva (02:40.91)

Mm.

gary yourofsky (03:03.225)

When I saw the animals, when I heard their screams, when I looked into their eyes and saw the pain and the fear that they were experiencing, I mean, it made me cry. Tears rolling down my face. And you know what? Real men do cry. Real men do protect those who are weaker than them. They don't take advantage of those who are weaker than they are. Now, what's interesting, you asked me about the term animal lover. Early on, I found it to be offensive.

in the same way white people get called an end lover when they stand up for black people. It's not about that. It's about fighting injustice. But I gotta say, over the last 29 years of my veganism, I am an animal lover. I don't find that to be offensive anymore and I'm proud to say that I love all the animals that I encounter. Even the ones that kind of terrify me, like spiders.

There's a spider living in one of my plants right now and you know what? She's fine. She can live in my Drexina plant. I'm cool with her. I just don't want her crawling all over me. She's gonna freak me out. But as long as she keeps her distance, I'm like, all right, I love you too, man. I love, kinda like how Jim Carrey was in When Nature Calls. Was that the name of the movie? When Nature Calls? With Jim Carrey? When he's saving the bad and he's like,

And he's running with the bat. That's how I am with the spider kingdom. It's like no I don't want to kill him. I don't want to touch him either. Just get him away, but I will always help. I will always help anybody.

Bryan (04:36.008)

That's it. That's right.

That's right. I love it. Well, well said, Gary. I appreciate that. That a beautiful introduction. And I got so excited because you're here to hang out with us that I forgot to take a couple seconds and introduce my two co-hosts with me here. So Bruce, I'm going to tee it up to you. Give a quick introduction on, your journey here and please tee up a good question for Gary. We'll let Gary answer that and then we'll tee it up to Justin here. So Bruce, take it away.

Bruce Da Silva (05:04.782)

Or sure, definitely. I'm out on mute. Yeah, so just short journey with veganism. Essentially, when I was seven, went vegetarian for maybe a week, got really sick, so kind of gave it up. And then midway through college, I had a friend in my logic class of all places, just tell me that...

Eggs are chicken's period blood and that kind of freaked me out. said, oh my God. And then I said my last semester of college I'd go vegan, which I did. And then I moved to the Middle East. So I was in Morocco working with the US government for a year and I really did want to maintain being vegan. I didn't, I mean now it's an excuse of course that I realize it. At the time I believe I didn't have the tools to articulate and explain and be compelling with my ideas, especially when I'm a guest in someone's home and they were asking me why I don't eat the animal.

or the food that they had and I didn't want to lie. I didn't want to say it was for the environment, blah blah blah, for health. For me it was really just once you see this stuff you can't go back. But I didn't have the, not just the courage but also the skills to communicate that. So I lived abroad a little bit longer in the Middle East and then I moved to DC and then it was right about December of 2020 I was really starting to get into it. I was looking at some of your stuff, ASPE, Earthling Ed and just a bunch of other stuff. And then I had watched

film called Okja which just you know as I was watching this film I actually had made some food that I was gonna eat some pasta and I was already telling my brother because I was with him at the moment you know I'm really thinking about going vegan yeah it makes a lot of sense blah blah blah he goes alright I mean whatever yada yada

So I'm there, I'm watching this film and I'm eating the pasta and he goes, Bruce, you know there's milk in the sauce, right? What? They're putting milk in the sauce? These people put milk in everything. So I'm watching Ochha and then I'm just getting towards the end where they're in these mess, I mean, I know you'd be familiar with the language, but it looks like concentration camps. And I thought, no, this is crazy. So the movie finishes and I just throw out the food that I had. I went in the kitchen, poured out my big tub of pasta that I had. And then from there,

gary yourofsky (06:41.635)

. .

Bruce Da Silva (07:10.448)

never did any of that again. So then fast forward, a few years later now I'm in LA, about four or five years later, and I realized that there was a really big gap in the vegan space. You know, it great being in LA, great being vegan, great people, but I noticed that there was a gap where there, you know, two issues. That one, being vegan, it's like what the hell's wrong with you?

And then the other issue was being a man, what the hell is wrong with you? So I realized, oh, there's two kinds of issues, you know? And so I decided to just see what would make sense. I met with Justin, we were speaking about it and some other guys. That's where we created the whole vegan men's group. Because for me, I realized that it's not enough to just be vegan, that if you ignore the overall areas of your wellbeing, of your mindset, things like this, you're not going to do well. And unfortunately, throughout my activism, which I'm sure you've seen way more, I met a lot of vegan guys that were either

gary yourofsky (07:36.163)

exhibit.

gary yourofsky (07:47.587)

.

Bruce Da Silva (08:01.716)

unhealthy, that they were in really bad relationships, or they didn't know how to foster any, that they were not doing well financially, or they were overall miserable. And my realization was, how can we show up the best for the animals and for ourselves to continue on this journey if we are struggling significantly in these areas? So all that kind of comes full circle and now it's just amazing to be speaking with you and these other two amazing gentlemen that are really just trying to show what it really means to be masculine in the sense of being compassionate and

towards the animals who literally can't do anything for themselves. And for me, the absolute antithesis of being anything of a healthy and masculine man, which, you know, we can always play around with the definitions and stuff, the antithesis of that is abusing, exploiting, or hurting an individual that can do nothing to defend themselves and that hasn't done anything to harm us. So with all that, that's sort of the arc. Just being here is amazing. So all that's tie in with the question now is,

With of course, real many plants and just the whole masculine frame, how have you noticed that we as men can actually advocate for the animals and just in a way that's consistent with being strong and being a protector and just kind of disregard any of these notions that we're weak because we're not eating animals or that being vegan is a sign of being very feminine or being things like that. How would you normally suggest going about that?

gary yourofsky (09:27.917)

Well, first of all, I would use the masculinity that we all have. It's this made-up notion that veganism is for weak people, that it is effeminate. Again, and I said it before, a real man does not take advantage

does not violate somebody that is weaker than they are, a real man would protect those who are weaker than they are. And I stood in front of every class as they were all chuckling when I came in and saying the same stuff. Look at the fucking vegan up there. Look at this fucking pussy up there. And then when I start talking and start explaining injustice and start explaining the Holocaust that's going on and looking the way that I look, listen, I always worked out. I love working out. Been working out my whole life.

But I really didn't like working out every single morning at 5am. But I did it because we live in a superficial world. So I had to maintain this physique where all of sudden the guys started saying, man, I heard him whispering that he's a pretty big vegan. Look at him, he looks pretty good. Even had a couple guys over the years during Q &A sessions that would still challenge me on physique or strength. I took my shirt off in front of the class several times.

and said why don't you take your shirt off right now? don't you show me your pipes? And none of them took me up on it and all the girls in the room actually laughing at them. Not laughing at me, they're like, man, looks pretty good. So listen, stand up like a man would. Don't fall victim. Don't fall prey to all those horrible stereotypes about vegans being weak. And especially, you know, know a few guys out there who are badass vegans.

like James Wilkes, the fighter, you know, like the Diaz brothers who were, you know, vegan fighters too, like Patrick Baboumian, the strong man from Germany, Avi Lainey, the strong man from Israel. There are tons of strong, badass, vegan dudes and vegan athletes, and even if they're not muscular and big like that, Novak Djokovic, best tennis player of all time, has been a raw vegan for the last 15, 18, 20-some odd years.

gary yourofsky (11:37.941)

Baddest dude ever. He's on a decline right now, but not everybody can stay at the top of their game forever. But when Djokovic was in his prime, not Federer, not Nadel, nobody fucked with him. He has the most majors of all time, so I'd stand up like a tough guy would. And listen, I'm gonna bring this up. I know not a lot of people are fond of this, but if push came to shove, and it did during some of my Q &A sessions,

I did about 200 lectures a year. I had about 15 or 20 that turned into a Jerry Springer show. Not because of me, because of them. Their foundations crumbled and they started screaming and yelling and I tried my best to subdue it, but you know, after a while when they were no longer listening, when they were freaking out, I said, why you come put your hands on me and show me how tough tough guys really are. Now one of them took me up on the offer because I'll tell you what, what I noticed about meat, dairy and egg eaters.

Bryan (12:13.801)

Mm.

Bruce Da Silva (12:29.038)

Hmm.

gary yourofsky (12:35.249)

These so-called tough guys are fucking pussies when somebody else bullies them. I notice that bullies, when they get bullied, all of a sudden they're not so tough anymore and that's why they're bullies. Everybody's afraid. They're walking around, you know, bullying everybody, bullying the animals. These are the same guys that would bully their women, beat up their girlfriends, beat up their children, whatever it is, psychologically abused. I would now get up and say, come on now, show me how tough you really are. Put your hands on me.

tell you a funny story real quick. was doing a protest. This is back in the 90s. I don't think I told this story by the way, and I've done about 60 podcasts. There were, it was at a circus in a really hillbilly town in Michigan, in Belleville, I believe. And of course the police always showed up when Gary was around. Their favorite pastime in Michigan, let's go fuck with Gary. But anyways, I walked up to the cops. I always did. I always said, listen, I'm not here to mess with you guys.

Bruce Da Silva (13:30.765)

Yes.

gary yourofsky (13:34.528)

I'm here to inform people what's going on. These cops are actually cool. So they said, Gear, just be cool today. I said, don't worry, I'm going to be cool. All of sudden, about 25 hunters, I knew they were hunters, they had camouflage on, they came up and started harassing us. So I did one of my tough guy moves. I took off my shirt. And back then, by the way, I'm only 170 right now. Back in the 90s, I was 207, so I was more intimidating than I am now.

and I took my shirt off and I said come on, I'll 25 you right now, let's go. Come on, I'm Bruce Lee right now, let's do it. And you know what they did? These fucking bully sissies, they ran and got the police. The 25 guys, now I said I was Bruce Lee but between me and you I'm not. I'm not the 25, I didn't know what I was gonna do but I know guys hate being intimidated, right? We all admit to this.

guys hate it so i always intimidated first they ran and got the police 25 against one cops came up to me and said Gary I thought you were gonna be cool I said that was cool and then everything ended up being okay but I'll tell you what I'm telling you bullies hate to be bullied so I don't like this and I know there's I have a couple essays on when violence is appropriate I don't say it with glee

Bryan (14:43.477)

It was, it sounds very cool.

gary yourofsky (15:00.114)

And even though we're laughing and giggling and the stories are funny, I don't want it to turn that way. Whenever I went out to educate somebody, whether it at a street protest or in the classroom especially, I wanted to do the pacifism thing. And I did. And I started that way. I'm like, let me tell you something. You guys aren't aware of this. You know the famous speech I gave. Listen, I want to take your blinders off. You've been programmed. You've been brainwashed.

Just like me, I'm no different. I wasn't born this way. You know, I've made this good rapport with the students and with the crowd every time, but sometimes, sometimes love doesn't conquer hate and people have to face it. And then, you know, I'm willing to take it up a notch. I was always willing to take it up a notch. people, listen, the police didn't know how to handle me sometimes. When the police weren't cool and they'd come and threaten to arrest me, you know what I would do? I would stand up.

Bryan (15:41.301)

That's right.

gary yourofsky (15:57.735)

I'd put my hands behind my back and I'd walk backwards and I'd bump him. I said, go ahead and arrest me. I give a fuck. Go ahead arrest me. Take me to jail. Because I'm going to come back in four hours and be right here again. Now what? And the cops would back off and go, man, you're crazy. I go, why? Why? Because I'm not afraid of you? You're trying to intimidate and bully me. Well, you know what? Go ahead. Take me to jail. I don't care. Now, this was Gary back in the 90s. People think I'm radical now. If you didn't know me in the 90s, you don't know how radical I was.

Bruce Da Silva (16:14.659)

Mm.

gary yourofsky (16:27.359)

I didn't care about going to jail. I would interrupt judges during court sessions. I didn't care about the judges. I didn't care about the cops. Now, I would still go to jail for the animals. I'd still give my life for them. Of course I would. But I'll be honest, I'm 55 now. I'm kind of comfortably numb and I don't want to. But back in the 90s, I really didn't mind if they took me to jail. It didn't mean anything to me. And I knew I would always get out anyways. And I knew whatever I was going through.

Bryan (16:52.021)

That's right.

gary yourofsky (16:56.978)

was nothing compared to what the animals were going through. And I have a statement that I always said, I'm gonna say it again, I always spoke for the animals like I would wanna be spoken for if I were in their position. And that was the basis of my activism. Hold people accountable, speak truthfully, don't be a politician, don't mince words, and do the same thing that you would want done for you.

Bruce Da Silva (17:24.578)

Hmm. Yeah, that's very well said. I mean, I think it's spot on. And I think one of the challenges is a lot of times when we do resort to getting maybe angry, it's because we're not sure of how to communicate an idea. But also, I think, especially in the masculine world, I think that from my experience, I've noticed that men truly tend to at least respect.

Bryan (17:25.725)

Amen. I love it.

Bruce Da Silva (17:47.054)

another man enough if they're actually willing to put something on the line, right? Saying, oh, you know, we have 25 of us, oh, I'm gonna run. Oh, look at this guy, he doesn't believe what he's, he actually doesn't believe what he's talking about, right? All the figures in history, for good or bad, have been willing to sacrifice something for a belief. And I think if you're not willing to sacrifice anything, it doesn't have to be everything, we all have different extremes, but nothing, if you're not willing to sacrifice at all, it's hard for me and other, just even men in general, to look at someone and say, that's a guy, I may disagree with Gary,

But man, I gotta respect this guy, because I wouldn't do that. I'd be a coward. I'd run from 25 hunters, for God's sake. So I think that's just a testament that, I don't know if I need to get violent or aggressive, different approaches, but if you can't stand behind your belief in the way that you did, how much is your belief really worth?

Bryan (18:36.182)

That's right. That's right. Well said. Well said.

gary yourofsky (18:37.42)

And intimidation is the key. Again, if you intimidate first, you're usually going to win. I'll be honest. This is a funny story. I was only intimidated once. And it was when I was in jail for the mink liberation. I liberated 1,542 mink from an animal concentration camp in Blenheim, Ontario, 97. Two years later, the trial finally takes place. I'm sentenced to 77 days in a max.

Detention center I get put in the first night. I'm all over the news Leech story 5 o'clock 5 30 6 o'clock news and the alpha male was a pretty big guy in the cell that I was in in the unit He turns around he says where the hell you get off coming to my country and doing this that was in Canada I'm from Michigan and I said listen man I went to liberate some animals and we're gonna have their necks broken the skin ripped off their bodies It's a violent act that we do and I was trying to stop the violence

This guy says to me, you're in the wrong fucking cell because we're all fucking violent. I've never been intimidated in my life, but instantly, and you gotta understand my crazy brain, this all happens in two seconds in my head. Holy shit, what a great line. I wish I came up with that. man, I'm gonna get my ass kicked right now, but if I get out of this, I can't wait to tell everybody this great line. You're in the wrong fucking cell because we're all fucking violent.

Now, I put up my hands to fight and mind you, he's got 10 guys behind him. They're walking towards me. And I'm just like, my God, here comes the Bruce Lee moment that I'm really not real life. So I got my hands up and I always knew with activism, somebody was looking out for me, some higher being. At that moment, the warden walks down the hall and calls me over to the side of the cell. said, hey, Yurowski, come over here. I said, well.

You know, under my breath I'm like, my god, and he wanted to tell me the rules of the prison. He goes, every Tuesday's the commissary, you can only have 50 bucks in your account, every morning you make your bed and blah blah blah. And under my breath I said, can I speak to you in private? And he looks at me up and down, he's trying to see if I'm being honest, what do I want? He goes, why? I said, just, can I speak to you in private? I'd appreciate it.

Bryan (20:35.081)

Uh-uh.

gary yourofsky (20:51.575)

And he looks me up and down again and he tells the guard, open up the cell, bring the Raschke down the hallway. He walks me down the hallway, what's up? I said, well, I can't really tell you exactly what's going on. I just appreciate if you move me to a different unit. If you don't, there's gonna be a lot of trouble. Just move me to a different unit. And he ends up moving me somewhere else. man, that guy, that, great intimidating line goes a long way. That was the only time.

I ever got got though, but every other time I always put the other guys in their spot. They didn't know what to do. So intimidation is key.

Bruce Da Silva (21:28.694)

All the other animals do it, you know, so come on now.

Bryan (21:29.098)

Well,

Bryan (21:32.896)

Justin, I want to give you a chance to say hello, introduce yourself, ask Gary a good question, so tee it up for us.

Justin Garfield (21:39.74)

Sure, certainly Brian. Gary, it's an honor to be here interviewing you with these great gentlemen here. I'm Justin Garfield. The first real memory of me loving animals was when I was really little growing up in Houston. There was a place that we used to go called Carol's Country Farm, which is like a petting zoo type thing, but a whole thing where the animals would be around. And I remember just holding this little bunny in my hands and I just felt its empathy. mind you, I'm in preschool right now.

And I just loved it. I loved it. I kissing it. And it was just so sweet. And I remember seeing things on TV that people would hunt these things and cook them. Like, how could you ever do this to this little thing? But nonetheless, I was living in Texas, which was a tougher place to be anything close to thinking that when you're young and then when you're living in a state that's known for its barbecue. Now, I went vegetarian for about a week in eighth grade after seeing a video on ChooseVeg.org.

gary yourofsky (22:28.197)

So.

Justin Garfield (22:39.111)

Back when I was on MySpace, I saw an ad for it on the sidebar late at night, and I watched it, and that 45 minutes changed my life forever. I remember just crying, watching the video and seeing all the pigs screaming and the cows getting their throats slit with chainsaws. I just couldn't bear with it. So a week, I'd go vegetarian, but I was still young and it was all around me, so I gave in for the poultry and the eggs and the fish.

But I stopped eating red meat. And then when I got to college, I came out to LA and my uncle, who Bruce and Brian have probably met through the Vegan Men's Society, Glenn, I went to visit him during spring break and I decided to eat vegan with him because he'd been vegan for a long time. And I just wanted to try it. It more open minded to it. And I felt so great. It felt amazing to not put those animal products in my body. And I felt a lot stronger. And now that I was 18,

and more free to do about my life.

I was like, why do I ever want to go back? Because I love animals and I feel great without them. And that was now 12 years ago. Here I am at 31, just feeling the best that I've ever been. And with that too. So Gary, you've used the words concentration camp, Holocaust throughout your career and several times today so far. I'm a Jewish guy, you're a Jewish guy. I've had vegan Jews even come up to me and say, no, you should not use those terms because you can never compare the Holocaust to what happens in those factory farms.

Now, me personally, I've always thought, well, why not? Think how many animals die in these horrible places per year versus a tragic Holocaust where six million Jews were killed in these very similar conditions. So just the first thing I want to tee off of you is have you been confronted with this from vegan Jews yourself and what is your response to them to help make that connection?

gary yourofsky (24:35.68)

Of course I've heard every excuse and every comeback ever with all the lectures and all the media interviews but for the most part the vegan Jews or not even the vegan Jews the Jewish community was always really open when I talked about it I did a

You guys probably know what I did in Israel in 2012 and 2013. They claimed that I converted 5 to 10 % of the population. It was an amazing experience. It was absolutely nuts. I only got a little pushback, but when I did, all I said was, a second, you're actually transporting animals to their murderous demise in the same train cars that Jews were taken to for their murderous demise.

And if you went to Auschwitz or Birkenau and you took the Jews out and put cows, pigs, and chickens, and turkeys in, how is it not the same exact thing? Because if you went to a slaughterhouse near Auschwitz and took out the cows, pigs, chickens, and turkeys and put Jews in, all of sudden it is a slaughterhouse. So it's more of this speciesistic mentality, this we don't want to be compared to animals. And I got news for people nowadays.

I don't even want to make these comparisons because I don't want to insult the animal kingdom by comparing their Holocaust to the Jewish Holocaust, to the Armenian Holocaust, to black slavery, to what humans have gone through because 6 million Jews, and again I'm Jewish, can say this, 6 million Jews? In the time I just said this, 6 million animals died around the world. It doesn't even compare when you take a look at the numbers. You could add up all the op-

oppressed, raped and murdered human beings since the beginning of time and in two weeks on this planet, we are, the animals already surpassed those numbers. This is the world's biggest holocaust. This is the world's biggest form of slavery. Then baby stealing non-stop? I find this to be atrocious. In fact,

gary yourofsky (26:39.033)

The slaughterhouse to me is no longer the worst part of what we do to the animals. To me it's now like the fourth or fifth worst thing that we do. The longer that I'm involved in this, baby stealing. Could you imagine with all the atrocities that humans are committing against each other, the baby stealing is usually the worst. Black slavery that was going on in America for 400 years, that the white slave owner thought that they owned the baby that came out of the black woman.

And if you brought this up, people would be up in arms. my God, they stole their baby. That was probably the worst thing that was going on with black slavery in America. And here we are every single day. Cows and pigs, chickens and turkeys are giving birth. And the mom of that baby no longer owns the baby. The meat, dairy and egg eater owns the baby. The meat, dairy and egg industries own the baby.

I find it to be outrageous and I find any Jew or any black person that doesn't want to accept the slavery analogies, I find them to be egotistical, arrogant, close-minded and outrageous. And by the way, why would it bother you so much to make a comparison with somebody else's pain and suffering? Why would that upset... I never really understood people getting upset. Why would you be like, proud of my injustice?

Bruce Da Silva (27:59.502)

Mm.

gary yourofsky (28:06.666)

is worse than your injustice. Well, how about all injustices are bad? Didn't Dr. King say injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere? I don't understand when people get offended when animals and what they're going through when we use words like Holocaust, we use words like slavery because that's exactly what it is. I mean, I don't know a better way to describe it. I'm not trying to be a shock jock. I'm just trying to find the best phrase and the best words to describe what's going on.

Bryan (28:15.68)

Yes.

gary yourofsky (28:36.702)

And all the human atrocities that I learned about through my life when I finally realized what animals were going through, I'm like, this is the same thing. I'll give an easy analogy too for the slavery stuff, and I'll just use the circus. You have elephants, monkeys, bears, tigers, and lions being kept in chains or in cages, being forced to perform against their will while somebody else profits off their labor.

How is that not the exact definition of slavery? And how is a place that kills innocent beings for doing nothing to deserve it, how is this not a concentration camp? How is this not a holocaust? I don't even understand what words they want to use, but keep this in mind, because I've done this with people too. said, I'll tell you what, I won't use the word holocaust, I won't use the word slavery.

Bruce Da Silva (29:16.866)

Mmm.

gary yourofsky (29:35.179)

You tell me what words you want me to use. And by the way, I'm curious too, would that change your mind? Would that make you become vegan? Because if it will, I'll stop using it. But you know what? It's still not going to change their mind. So what's the point? They're just arguing. They're just being defiant for no reason. Because I'll do anything. I've gotten on my knees in front of classes before.

Bruce Da Silva (29:43.214)

Hmm

Bryan (29:44.747)

Mm.

Bruce Da Silva (29:58.29)

Mm, mm.

gary yourofsky (30:03.48)

when they started fighting with me. I said, I'm on my knees right now. Just do this for me then. What do you want from me? I'll do anything. You tell me what it takes for you to become vegan. Here, I'm a grown man on my knees in front of a crowd begging you. And you know what? They still said no. I'm like, well, then what's the deal? What are you arguing with me for? What are you upset that I said this or made this comparison? There's nothing that I could have said. That's what I'm getting from this. There's nothing that I could have said to make you open up your mind.

So then what are you arguing with me for? Why don't... And I was just talking to Carmen this morning, my social media manager, I said, do you know what I've noticed? That there's nothing that you can say sometimes to make somebody get it. Like, what do want me to do? What do you want me to say? You still don't care and you still won't change. So why don't you just look me in the eyes and tell me one of two things. You don't give a shit or you're too lazy to change.

Bryan (30:51.628)

Yeah.

Bruce Da Silva (31:02.734)

Mmm.

gary yourofsky (31:02.817)

Because then, you wanna shut Gary up? I'll shut up. Because guess what? I can't make you give a shit. I can't make you be not lazy. But if you wanna come up with excuses and rationalizations, you wanna tell me God says it's okay, you wanna tell me you can't get your protein anywhere else, you wanna tell me animals don't think, they don't suffer, that they're in centian beans, you wanna tell me...

this comparison's not valid? Well, we're gonna have an argument. We're gonna have a fight because everything I'm saying is true. But if you tell me, hey, I don't give a shit. I once said that to several classes that started this Jerry Springer show. I said, why don't you guys just tell me you don't give a shit? And then they all screamed out, don't give a shit. I said, well then why don't you just say that? Why did you argue with me about God says it was okay? Just say, I don't give a shit. And you know what? I'll go away, all right? I don't know what else to say then if you don't give a shit.

After everything that I just said, just poured my heart out to you. I told you about baby stealing and electro-ejaculation, raping female animals. I told you about a house of slaughter. I told you about the animals and all the fear they're experiencing. I told you about all this and you still don't care? Well then, I don't know what else to say to be honest with you. So I'm always out there and I think you guys know this or you're probably doing it and not knowing it if you're not aware.

Bryan (32:16.312)

Mm.

gary yourofsky (32:21.949)

Always look for those who are open-minded first. I hate to say it. You have to find those who are willing to listen just like we all were, just like all the vegans. Because even though I talk about... When I talk about my lecture tour, it's not really entertaining when I tell people, my God, the whole crowd cried and told me that I was the second coming of Jesus, that I was Gandhi, and I changed everybody's life. It sounds arrogant.

Bryan (32:26.082)

Yeah.

Bryan (32:33.388)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (32:49.312)

The stories I tell are the confrontational stories because they're more entertaining, but 50 % I had a 50 % conversion rate most of the time and at the very least professors did surveys and told me I always had a 15 to 20 % conversion rate no matter what. So there were always open-minded people and as soon as I walked into every classroom

I don't know why I have this gift and I know it sounds weird but I could walk into a classroom as I did 2660 times and as soon as I entered I would point towards everybody in my head I'd say, good, good, good, bad, good, bad, on the fence, on the fence, on the fence, good, bad, guess what? 99.9 % accuracy. I was, I knew exactly how everybody, I had the vegan radar down pat.

Bryan (33:31.512)

Right.

Bruce Da Silva (33:32.942)

Yeah.

Bryan (33:43.288)

I love it.

gary yourofsky (33:43.688)

And I still have it these days, but so as the lecture went on, guess what? I stopped looking at the bad people and the ones that were on the fence that came over. I looked at them more, the ones that fell off the fence. I let them go and I focused on those who were listening, who were willing to be deprogrammed, who had an open mind. And we have to understand, and this is what sucks, sometimes no matter what you say or how you say it,

It's never gonna work if the listener isn't ready to hear the message, isn't willing to listen. Because I caught some flack over the years from some vegans in the movement, Gary you're too harsh, Gary you're too radical, you shouldn't say Holocaust, you shouldn't say slavery. And I'd always come back and say I'm curious but with all the soft ways that you're going about, so how many people have you converted?

way zero or zero I mean you're talking to somebody that converted what they're saying now is hundreds of thousands to millions worldwide and people still question me and say oh Gary you shouldn't do this and shouldn't do that I'll tell you what works is how I am the truth I'm truthful and I'm not a politician and I hold people accountable I put them in the victim's position every professor every single one would always tell me man

Bruce Da Silva (34:43.63)

Mmm.

Bryan (34:44.012)

That's right.

Bruce Da Silva (34:46.104)

Yes.

gary yourofsky (35:11.945)

We have never met a real activist in our life. And we never met anybody who wasn't a politician when they were pushing a cause. And that's why your lectures work in all these classes. And that's why I bring you in. Because I wasn't selling anything. I wasn't collecting people's emails. I wasn't passing around a collection plate. I didn't want people's money. I wanted their minds. And I told them I got...

Bryan (35:34.342)

Ahem.

gary yourofsky (35:40.35)

I got no books to sell you. I'm not here to sell you anything. Listen to me. I just want to tell you something that I learned years ago. Because if I can understand it, there's no reason why you can't. Because I'm no scholar. And it doesn't take a scholar to get compassion. I'm no PhD. It doesn't take a PhD to understand compassion. In fact, sometimes I find the PhDs could be the most difficult of all.

It just takes an open mind and an open heart and to put yourself in their position. And that's all I ever did along the way when I was learning. kept thinking, man, how would I feel if I was that elephant in the circus, that pig in that truck waiting to be called in the Thornhill Valley pig slaughterhouse when I went and investigated this stuff in 1993. How would I feel if I was the monkey in the laboratory, the mouse in the laboratory? How would I feel? This has to be horrible.

to be viewed as nothing, to be treated like your life doesn't matter, and to be absolutely... You know what? This is probably the second worst thing that we do to animals. I talked about stealing their babies. The second worst thing is we actually plan their execution before they're even born. And people still have the audacity to say that vegans are crazy or that...

Bryan (36:57.816)

Yeah.

Bruce Da Silva (36:59.758)

Hmm.

gary yourofsky (37:06.932)

that I don't even understand the defiance anymore. My brain has melted, by the way, 29 years. I used to be a lot sharper than I am these days. My brain has melted. Now, you shouldn't see me when I was in my prime, I was something else. I mean, nowadays, sometimes I have a tough time grasping things, grabbing things, because my brain is melting. Like, what else am I supposed to say? In fact, when I had to retire,

Bryan (37:18.802)

you're...

Bryan (37:23.926)

Yeah.

gary yourofsky (37:35.719)

Officially in 2015 from my lectures and 17 from being online Yeah, I just had complete brain melt and I didn't know what we were fighting about anymore What what's the argument? I hope somebody would say something say what I asked you not to kill somebody I asked you not to rape somebody else. Why are we having a why isn't your response? man, I didn't realize

Bruce Da Silva (37:49.762)

Hmm.

gary yourofsky (38:03.366)

Now for the most part that was everybody's response when I lectured they were wonderful but I did have those 15 or 20 out of 200 lectures a year Jerry Springer shows where the crowd just went fucking bat shit crazy. Don't understand what...

Bruce Da Silva (38:03.437)

Gary.

Bryan (38:03.469)

Yeah, you see.

Bryan (38:18.061)

Yeah. You see, you see this in so many industries in that sense of, know, the, insurance agents or the police or the firemen that have to go through these situations day in and day out. And so we appreciate you being back and helping to spread the word again. And, and I think you've touched on this several times throughout what you've told us so far, but I'd love to tease it out and get your viewpoint on, on

Bruce Da Silva (38:19.117)

Gary.

Bryan (38:44.141)

you know, the cash cow itself, the animal agriculture industry that we've been talking about. It's this billion dollar machine. And from a strategic viewpoint, it's the single biggest economic vulnerability of this industry that we as ethical consumers and activists should be targeting right now to maximize our impact on it and hasten its decline as quick as we can. and like we see it with like

Beyond meat is all in the news right now because it was down to 50 cents a share and we were talking about it in VMS. Like, should we buy this and help drive up the stock or something like GameStop? Like, what do you see as the single most thing that we can do? Like, we can't all be out there protesting every day, but we are voting with our our pocketbooks and our wallets every single day. Do you have some advice for us vegans and all the guys watching this podcast on

how we can make sure we maximize everything that we do that drives this industry to close.

gary yourofsky (39:44.082)

That's the main thing that we can do is not support the industry monetarily. This is why I decided to take my street activism to the classroom. I wanted to turn people vegan one by one. I know it's a long slow battle that way, but so many people said, no, you need to go to the industries. You need to go to McDonald's and Burger King and KFC and ConAgra and Tyson. said, no, no, these people ain't changed. These businesses ain't changing.

They're making not billions, they're making trillions of dollars off the backs, literally, of innocent beings. But if I can get the population to no longer support them, then they're gonna have to listen and change. Which is why over the years, I saw at first, think Dean Foods might have been the first big company to buy a vegan company. They bought Silk Soy Milk back in the day. I don't know if they still own them, but...

Bruce Da Silva (40:20.386)

Bye.

gary yourofsky (40:40.572)

Dean Foods was actually responsible for putting silk soy milk in all the grocery stores over America. It wasn't the vegans. It wasn't PETA. It wasn't Gary Yourofsky. It was Dean Foods. Now these, Dean Foods, the biggest exploiter of animals in the dairy industry, wow, but they saw the writing on the wall. And if we can show them that the future is veganism, they're gonna have to change or go out of business. So I...

Bryan (40:47.479)

Hmm.

gary yourofsky (41:10.289)

I completely adore reaching out to the masses because it's basically supply and demand, right? We have to reduce the demand and next thing you know, everything is going to change. But again, this isn't a billion dollar, this is a trillion dollar industry. And as far as I know from my studies, this has been the biggest business on the planet since the beginning of time. Animal slavery, nothing comes close.

You can add up computers and cars nowadays. They don't come close to the animal slavery trade. This is the biggest business on the planet, but this is also why it is the most difficult to destroy. That's how massive this is. But with companies like Beyond Meat, Impossible, Gardein, Tofurky, Follow Your Heart, we can win this battle, especially if we as consumers stop

Bryan (41:44.921)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (42:04.337)

buying these products, start buying the good products. And by the way, it is okay to buy products even if they're not owned by vegan companies. They keep track of where the money's coming in from, because so many people over the years, oh, Gary, why would you tell people to buy silk soy milk? Dean Foods owns it. And I tell them what I just told them, Dean Foods puts silk soy milk in all the groceries. Why? To lose money? No, because they're making money. They know, oh my God, we're making money from this.

Next thing you know, they're gonna reduce the dairy side. When we go to a restaurant, start buying the vegan products at the restaurant, the vegan menu options, all of sudden next year, they add another vegan option, then another vegan option, and then one day Burger King's gonna be Soy King, McDonald's is gonna be McSoy one day, because you're not gonna destroy McDonald's. We're gonna convert McDonald's over, so we have to support whatever vegan items are there.

Bryan (42:36.664)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (42:58.777)

And for the people who are still, for the vegans who are still defiant with me when I say this, easy comeback is, I'm sorry, which vegan grocery store do you shop at? Which gas station, when you fill up your car, do you go to that doesn't sell meat, dairy, and eggs there? You're bringing up these ridiculous arguments when you're taking part in it too. So it's okay. Listen, as long as you're buying vegan, living vegan, that's all you can do.

but you have to let the industries know. You have to let them know what's the profitable item. And this is why so many regular items, forget about animal slavery stuff, this is why products on the market disappear all the time. Because consumers stop buying them and all of sudden consumers demand this product. This is why we don't have black and white TV sets anymore. Nobody wants to buy them, they want color TV sets.

Bruce Da Silva (43:43.694)

Hmm.

gary yourofsky (43:53.828)

This is why we have plasma TV sets and LED TV sets. This is why we have cell phones and better cell phones and sleeker cell phones, whatever it is, we're demanding this stuff so that businesses have to make those products and change to appease the masses, because if the masses don't buy the product, they're not making money and that's the whole goal of the game and your business is to make money. But we need to let them know this stuff is profitable.

You can make just as much money off veganism without harming, without intentionally exploiting any animal, without intentionally doing evil things, without taking part in rape, slavery, electro-ejaculation, baby stealing and murder.

Bryan (44:22.776)

That's right.

Bruce Da Silva (44:38.04)

Gary, powerful. And yeah, there's so many other questions that we can run through. First thing is we got to get you on Jubilee. Although it is kind of like a one verse 20 versus kind of thing. So that creates a very combative dynamic, which isn't always the best, but we definitely got to get you on there somehow just to really.

Bryan (44:38.286)

Absolutely.

gary yourofsky (44:55.343)

Somebody just told me about that a few weeks ago, my buddy Arlo from Ohio, he's supposed to be trying to get me on there. That's when 20 people start throwing questions at one person. By the way, that was from 2002 to end of 2014 during my lecture tour. That's all I ever did, by the way. I would handle 25, 50, 100 students in a classroom. They're all throwing questions and I'm boom boom knocking everything down.

Bruce Da Silva (45:01.774)

You gotta get on.

Yes, yes.

Bryan (45:14.486)

I know, you'd be great at it.

gary yourofsky (45:21.679)

during my Israeli tour as well after the lectures and I had 500, 800, 1000 people I'd be surrounded by hundreds of people and I'd be doing a rotation like answering questions left and right I'm great at that shit by the way I love that stuff oh and by the way quick thing when people would ask me over the years how come I was so good at answering questions easy trick there's nothing that a meat, dairy and egg eater

Bruce Da Silva (45:37.708)

No, good. We definitely gotta get you there.

gary yourofsky (45:50.97)

can ever say that is truthful. If it was truthful, then animals would deserve everything that they're getting right now. So my whole entire goal and everyone's goal should be as soon as they start speaking, figure out the misinformation. Figure out the disinformation. Figure out what doesn't add up with this statement when they say God says it's okay. Well, wait a second, if God says it's okay,

Bruce Da Silva (45:54.445)

Oof.

Bruce Da Silva (46:00.62)

which they don't.

gary yourofsky (46:19.299)

then you're no longer talking about God, you're talking about the devil. Because if God is a snow-cow, would be a slave owner, a torturer, and a murderer of his babies. So, I mean, whatever they said to me, protein, well, of course, all, lentils and beans and fruits and vegetables have protein and nuts and seeds, like, what do mean there's no shortage of protein? Bring up all the vegan animals out there. Whatever the question was, whatever the comment was, what lions eat zebras?

I just did a video on Instagram about this and by the way, I made this challenge during every lecture I gave. No one ever took me up on it and I didn't speak to vegans during my lecture tour. I went to rural America, I went to rural Texas. I was in Wichita Falls speaking at Midwestern State University. I was at University of North Texas in Denton. I was at Beaufort Community College in rural North Carolina, Halifax Community College. I made the challenge. If you think that you're a lion all of sudden, well go outside.

Go run down a squirrel or any animal you want to. Kill the squirrel with no tools, no weapons, in your hands or in your mouth and eat the entire animal. Eyes, nose, face, toes, tail, anus, inner organs, blood and the fur. Show me you're a carnivore. Now I just did this video online. Would you believe all these fucking pussy carnivores? All these so-called omnivores. Now one person, all they said to me, well that's stupid. That's just a stupid argument. It's your fucking argument. What do you mean? It's...

Bryan (47:43.246)

That's right, it is.

gary yourofsky (47:44.588)

The number two, here, I have a ranking. are three, the three top excuses I've heard, and mind you, I talked to 60,000 meat, dairy, and egg eaters face to face. I know the excuses. Number one excuse, God says it's okay. Number two excuse, but lions eat zebras. And the third excuse was protein. So it's their number two excuse, all I ever heard, and now they wanna tell me it's a stupid challenge. It's your comeback, all you ever tell me is,

After God, lions eat zebras. I'm a lion, I'm a carnivore. No, you're not. No, you're not. You're not a lion. And by the way, omnivore and carnivore, same thing. That was another thing they tried to deflect. we're not carnivores, we're omnivores. All carnivores are omnivores. Everyone can eat everything. Don't tell me lions don't eat watermelons. Don't tell me hyenas don't find fruit and vegetables and don't eat that stuff. Stop it.

You can either eat raw flesh and kill an animal in your mouth or with your hands, with your paws, or you can't. But all they did was deflect and again, not one person took me up on the challenge to prove to me and show me that humans are meat eaters naturally. We're fake meat eaters. And in fact, I only have one or two regrets from my famous lecture. There was that section where I said, name me two words why everybody eats meat.

people were kind of afraid to say, you can say it, tastes good, right? And I make everybody laugh. I used a lot of sarcastic humor. I'm like, yeah, it tastes good. But you know what? After all these years, I was wrong. Meat doesn't taste good. The way we prepare it tastes good. I used to tell the students sometimes, I took a dead chicken and threw it on your desk right now and said, eat it, you'd be like, must be crazy. You better, first of all, you better clean it.

Bryan (49:19.354)

Mm-hmm.

Bryan (49:23.611)

I like to...

gary yourofsky (49:34.989)

You better pull the feathers off. You know, you better cut up up into pieces, put some oil on it, fry it, bake it, you know, grill it, barbecue it, slap it on with some seasonings, some salt, some pepper, whatever else, two slices of bread, pickles and onions, mustard and ketchup. It's everything else that we do to meet that makes it taste good. So these people.

Bryan (49:56.472)

I have to say that it's my number one comeback is the only way your meat tastes good is because you put my plants on it. That's the only way we make it taste good. I mean, you're just nailing it, nailing it, Gary. Bruce.

gary yourofsky (50:04.557)

Yeah? It's true! It's true! And, and these people, and sometimes these people say, oh, well, Kira, I eat rare, rare steaks. I didn't say rare, rare is still cooked. I said raw from the bones. And it's still been treated and cleaned and frozen and bleached and cured and salted. I'm talking from the animal. These people will, will, will use any excuse in the world not to be...

Bryan (50:18.137)

That's right. That's right.

Bryan (50:27.843)

Right, right.

gary yourofsky (50:32.173)

Kind and compassionate to the animals and I don't know why and then when we call them out, they don't want to listen. See, vegans have answers, meat, dairy and egg eaters have excuses.

Bryan (50:34.757)

Okay.

Bruce Da Silva (50:43.295)

Oof.

Bryan (50:43.803)

That's right.

Bruce Da Silva (50:43.98)

That's gotta be the tagline. Gary, we could continue riffing. Truly, it's exceptional. Transitioning with that as well, your work, your message is uncompromising, but of course there's a deep personal connection you have to Sasha Farm Animal Sanctuary in Michigan. Tell us just a little bit about that when you first learned about it, some of the work that they do, when you step into that kind of environment. Because a lot of people haven't been to any kind of sanctuary. And when you see them individually, what lessons do you learn about compassion?

and about healing and what do you take away from that that you wish everyone could experience? Just to kind of make that connection, right? Because right now you just shared for a bit about the excuses and how we have the answers, things like this, some of the disconnect, but then now how, from your experience, especially with Sasha, how has that reconnect occurred?

gary yourofsky (51:33.718)

Man, I found out about Sasha first year I went vegan in 96 and when I went there it was everything that I imagined how animals should be living. It was the garden of vegan, the garden of the eaten. It was a paradise. No animals were being exploited anymore. They had names, not numbers. They weren't being branded and tagged. It was the first time that I could really remember.

I mean, maybe when I was younger, I was at a petting zoo. I can't really remember. I'm sure I was. We all were at some time, but I didn't make any real connection. I was all of a sudden seeing the animals that I was fighting for face to face, realizing they were individuals, realizing they were just like my dogs, Bourbon and Brandy, just like Shadow, just like Rex and Doyle later on. They're just like the dogs and the cats that we adore, the horses we adore.

The whales and the dolphins we adore, the sloths that we adore. Notice too, it's always easy to adore animals when you're not eating them, when you're not wearing them, but all of sudden the cows, pigs, chickens and turkeys, it's actually a defense mechanism. We come up with these horrible excuses and rationalizations so we can imprison them, so we can enslave them, so we can harm them, steal their babies and murder them. But once I got there, man, it was just this paradise.

And I would recommend to all the vegans I noticed over the years that most vegans have never even met the cows pigs chickens and turkeys that they're always speaking out for and I'm gonna urge everybody get to your local sanctuary I know everyone doesn't live in Michigan, but I'm sure you got a sanctuary that has rescued animals who are going to be murdered who

who were abused and tormented at some point, get there, get to know these animals and see them look into their eyes and realize they have every right to be free, just like we're talking about. But you need to meet them and the vegans of the world need to understand this, the sanctuaries of the world only have the vegans to rely on. I do believe that meat, dairy and eggs

Bruce Da Silva (53:45.646)

Mmm.

Bryan (53:55.452)

I don't know if we lost your phone for a second there, Gary.

gary yourofsky (53:58.465)

League into the world. Yeah, you still here? Am I still here?

Bruce Da Silva (54:04.334)

Yes.

Bryan (54:04.715)

yeah, it's back. Go ahead. Keep going.

gary yourofsky (54:07.68)

Okay. So for the vegans of the world, you need to support, we need to support the sanctuaries. And what breaks my heart is a lot of vegans are not right now. If you, here, the word tithe, T-I-T-H-E, it's giving 10 % of your income to your religious institution, fuck the churches, fuck the mosque, and fuck the synagogues.

Tithe your money to the sanctuaries, okay, where it's needed. It's not needed at the religious institutions. They're getting by just fine. The sanctuaries of the world need our money, need our support. So Sasha Farm right now, and by the way, ever since I've been doing these podcasts, a ton of money's been coming in. I'm so happy. And by the way, none of the money comes to me for the people out there that don't like Gary. This is, this is, this this is.

pure altruism from Gary, because I've been going there for 30 years and it would break my heart if Sasha Farm went under. The old owner retired because the other owner passed away and now he's demanding that we pay him for the 50 acres of land that Sasha is on. I don't understand why he's doing this and demanding it, but he is. And 50 acres of land in Manchester, Michigan goes for $675,000. So we ended up signing a land contract. We got five years to pay him off.

money is coming in but we need more I'm looking for a big donor too if there's a big donor out there that could save the day because the former owner also took 250,000 out of the coffers which really damaged us and he's demanding that we pay him the other you know for for the 425 over the next five years and we're trying so send money to Sasha Farm if you can

And if you'd rather support your own local sanctuary, I'm not going to be upset either. I want people to support sanctuaries because they're struggling all over the world. Kurzyłapka in Poland, I just did a video for them. Little Bear Sanctuary in Florida. Freedom Farm in Israel. La Guerrie in France. There are tons of sanctuaries all over the world that are struggling right now. So please help your local sanctuary and don't just send money.

gary yourofsky (56:21.489)

Give some time, because one of the most rewarding things that I've ever experienced too is when I get to go to Sasha Farm and spend several hours helping clean up all the poop and helping fix the fences, maybe paint the barn. But when the day is done and I'm done helping and doing all the work, I get to play with the animals. I get to feed Beema and Apple. I get to feed some carrots to the horses. I get to pet Norman the donkey. I get to hang out with Wally the goat.

I get to hang out with all these amazing creatures and it's just, again, it's the only way to experience the Garden of Eden. If everyone's looking for this perfect paradise, it's at your local sanctuary. Get over there and do what you can to help them. So please help Sasha Farm. SashaFarm.org. There's a donation link on the main site. If you can help them, I would totally appreciate it.

Bryan (57:05.628)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (57:15.903)

And just so you know, Shara Jones runs the place. She's the animal care manager. She's a fantastic person who always puts in more time. She does get it. we're open now about salaries too. Shara gets a $50,000 a year salary and there's three people that are getting 21 an hour. Other than that, every penny goes to the animals for feed, for medical care, for fixing up the whole area.

And by the somebody brought up to me recently, Gary, what do you say to people who say, well you got them in prison at a sanctuary? Do know why there are fences at a sanctuary? Because all the fucking meat, dairy, and egg eaters would kill them if they wandered out. What do you mean? You act like we can let the cows go free? If there's a free cow server on this planet, people will track them down and kill them. They're not allowed to be free, besides certain parts of India, by the way.

Bryan (57:53.916)

That's right.

gary yourofsky (58:09.008)

And India is not wonderful with cows. The dairy industry there is horrid. I've just actually been communicating with some people there right now. They just took down some big documentary about the dairy industry. They're so strong there. But besides certain parts of India where cows are allowed to roam, do you realize? I think they're the most oppressed being on this planet. Other than that, there's not... If there's a cow that's wandering somewhere...

Bruce Da Silva (58:32.77)

Bye for now.

gary yourofsky (58:38.398)

They're gonna track them down and kill them. This is how oppressed, this is how exploited and enslaved cows are and all the animals that we eat and wear. They're not allowed to be free. Unbelievable.

Bryan (58:52.762)

We've got the Sasha Farm link on the screen here. had it there. And the QR code that's been up on the screen is a donation link as well. So scan either of those. Help make Gary and Sasha Farm super happy by donating some money there where you can. I want to let Justin ask another big question and then maybe we can do a couple of rapid fire questions, Gary. Get some quick hit answers from you on a couple of questions we've got teed up before we wrap up for the day here.

This has been so powerful. Justin, what do you have lined up?

Justin Garfield (59:23.353)

Well, Brian, on that note, Gary, a lot of my personal activism comes through social media as an influencer who loves to cook vegan food on social media.

who loves to just talk and share my stories on there. Well, your lectures have become viral vegan speech classics. If you had 30 seconds, and I'm gonna test you with the 30 second answer right here. If you had 30 seconds, how would you update the message for a TikTok expansion span? More critically, you're known for blunt truth telling. So where is that line between effective vegan advocacy and alienating the very people that you wanna reach?

gary yourofsky (59:44.353)

Hahaha

gary yourofsky (01:00:00.136)

Keep in mind, the people that are going to be alienated would be alienated if Gandhi came back from the dead and said everything in the most peaceful way possible. Again, the listener has to be ready and willing to listen. So don't ever think that the way you say something is going to alienate anybody. There's nothing that could be said to make those people listen. They're not ready to hear the message. And for 30 seconds,

It's the baby stealing stuff that I would say I would say listen black woman white woman Asian woman Latino woman They're pregnant. They have a baby whose baby is it? It's theirs of course okay cow pig chicken or turkey. They're pregnant They have a baby whose baby is it? yours the meat eaters the meat industries

Bruce Da Silva (01:00:46.946)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (01:00:53.629)

I used that by the way, I used that, and then that's under 30 seconds which is tough for me as you guys know. I liked it. By the way, that's why I actually went to the classroom too. On the street I only had 30 seconds on the street. It was like, please don't go to the circus, elephants are in chains, they beat the elephants. Oh wait, please don't go to circus, the lions are kept in cages. Please don't I'm like, man I need more time and I got the classroom, now I got 60, 70 minutes, shut the.

Justin Garfield (01:01:01.883)

Hahaha

gary yourofsky (01:01:18.717)

fuck up and listen because I'm gonna answer I'm not doing it to be a dick I know your questions I know your concerns just be quiet and let me tell you what you need to hear and you see the power of that speech that I gave I'm like I could explain this to everybody in 60 minutes but 30 seconds is tough but I used that 30 second line I went to Cologne Germany a few months ago and hung out with Anonymous for the Voiceless and

Bruce Da Silva (01:01:19.758)

Yeah.

gary yourofsky (01:01:45.533)

While I was traveling there on that long nine-hour plane ride I'm like I need something quick and then it hit me with the baby stuff my god use the use an example about the women being pregnant and then the female animals being pregnant and a lot of other Activists were using that I told a bunch when I got there I'm like if you got somebody difficult just pull this out because there's nothing they can say unless they're just the biggest dick on this planet and it's silenced just about everybody everybody even the ones that didn't want to change they were like

Okay, I see your point. There was a tough hunter guy that people were arguing with. Of course, they come run to me. And by the way, people put so much pressure on me. Like, Gary, come say... I'm like, God, I'm not Superman. Gary, can you reach this guy? And I used it. No, I said, okay, I got... I have something for you. He was fighting with everybody, about five or ten people. And then I gave him that baby stealing analogy. And he said, all right, I see your point there. But it still didn't make him say... But I can... Listen, I could silence a lot of people.

I don't know what the magic formula is for making somebody actually transition and change. Or I don't know the magic formula why some people get it and some people don't. Believe me, I've been trying to find it for last 29 years. But I do know harsh truth. Holding them accountable. Victims' position. That's the best way. That's the way that I was successful at reaching the hundreds of thousands or the millions of people that I reached.

Bryan (01:02:51.311)

Mm-hmm.

Bruce Da Silva (01:03:13.144)

Gary, question here with, especially just a quick rapid fire one, but specifically with the victim's position. I had just recently done a 10 day silent meditation retreat and there was no sensory stimuli. Basically you could just, no talking, no eye contact, no distraction, no phone, no reading, books, which no books for me is very tough. I like to read, none of that stuff. And you just had to sit and meditate for over 10 hours a day. It's a luxury for sure and it was very tough. But what I realized, you know,

towards midway through the week, got super bored and I was getting restless. It was really tough for me, so I got into my room and I wanted to pass the time, so I was counting the letters on my supplement bottles just to pass the time. I was losing my mind. And I was thinking, wow, look at this experience I just had, and this was tough. Now,

gary yourofsky (01:03:44.764)

Okay.

Bruce Da Silva (01:04:01.856)

I could only imagine, even just let's say the dogs or the animals that aren't in slaughterhouses, like dogs and cats or things like that, that aren't taken for walks and aren't able to connect, how tough that must be. And then as well, go even one step further for the animals that are in these crates, tiny, can't move, nothing, and just sound of fear and death. I mean, think things like that are just so pertinent to help us really make that connection of, wow, I mean, I was struggling. I can't even imagine what they were going like. But my question now, the quick one,

gary yourofsky (01:04:14.171)

.

Bryan (01:04:18.374)

Hmm.

Bruce Da Silva (01:04:31.76)

Before we go vegan, we didn't know veganism existed. then becoming aware of it is really kind of like a matrix moment, kind of becoming aware of this invisible belief system, this curtain, that now it's kind of open in a way. So my quick rapid fire question if we can is, my concern is for within the vegan movement that a lot of times this is the last place we stop and like, all right, this is the thing, let's figure it out. But how do we navigate it where, how do we know if the next aha vegan moment

gary yourofsky (01:04:43.867)

Okay.

Bruce Da Silva (01:05:02.001)

is there and that we're not blind to it, right? Like what else could we be missing that once we learn about it, like how do we make sure we're ready to learn about that next moment?

Bryan (01:05:04.828)

Ahem.

Bruce Da Silva (01:05:11.584)

of something that can really further advance our compassion, our intellect, our well-being, our spirituality. How would you go about that, especially being in the trenches for 29 years and just realizing you really have this powerful truth, but to make sure you don't blind yourself potentially or other vegans to other versions of truth that could be beneficial to our lives and also the vegan movement?

gary yourofsky (01:05:31.87)

Listen, I was never upset with any meat, dairy and egg eating student when I entered the classroom and I heard them and all their stupid snickering and all the stupid comments, the fucking vegans here, I should have brought a hamburger, I should have brought my deer's head. And I had to remember that I used to be the same way. We all have to remember this. We all have to...

set out to educate, enlighten, deprogram and un-brainwash as many people as possible. And anger's okay. Anger drove me. Use the anger in a positive way. And there are gonna be times when the anger spills over and you're just gonna go ballistic. Whatever, it happens. know, considering the social justice issue that we're involved in, don't...

Bryan (01:06:17.243)

Ahem.

gary yourofsky (01:06:20.186)

think it's not going to happen and it's okay as long as it's not all the time. I mean I did about 60 podcasts so far there was one where I had a blow up with a couple people and and so many people like oh my god though Gary, Gary had a meltdown. Are you kidding me? I had 300 meltdowns in 2660 lectures. You act like it was the first time I screamed at somebody. Are you kidding me? I've been screaming at people since 1996 since I became vegan but

I did always scream at people, it's a once in a while thing, you catch me on the wrong day, you say the wrong thing, you stop listening to me, I am gonna scream and yell at you. But, for the most part, way for the most part, for the most part of my lectures, I was there to educate, hold hands, I was there to cradle people, like, hold on a second, okay let me explain this to you in a better way. I always was thinking of,

better ways to explain the injustice. And my crazy brain now, you talked about 10 hours of meditation, man. you f- Fuck! I've meditated once in my life and it was over some horrible thing that I don't even know if I can talk about, I've never, Shavasana and yoga, that made me stop doing yoga. Cause I cannot meditate this crazy brain of mine, so, but this crazy brain of mine always came up with better ideas and better ways.

to explain the message. So all night long when I was trying to sleep and not sleeping, was like, what are you going to say when they say this, Gary? What are you going to say when they say this? And I'm like, I just want to sleep. And I go, wait a second. Let's see. We plan their execution before they're even born. that's a good line. OK, can I go to sleep now? No.

And what are you gonna say now when they say this? So every night for the last, you know, 20 some odd years, 25 plus years, my brain puts me in a mock debate to come up with better ways to say something. So try to do that if you're looking for a better way. Maybe you don't, and by the way, you don't have to say the things exactly the way I say it. If you don't feel comfortable for whatever reason saying Holocaust, saying slavery, saying murder, saying rape, nobody says you have to.

gary yourofsky (01:08:38.019)

But you do have to hold people accountable. You do have to tell them, you do have to put them in the victim's position in one way or another. I don't care how you say it, but put them in that position. It doesn't have to be the same terminology. Say what you feel comfortable saying. Not everybody. You people say, Garret, I can't say the things you said. Well, then don't. It's the concept. You hear the guy, you understand the concept of what I'm saying. This is a massacre. So don't say it's a holocaust. Say it's a massacre. It's definitely a massacre.

Bryan (01:08:55.013)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (01:09:06.827)

Say it's mass killing, you don't like saying murder, say kill, whatever it is, explain it. Explain it to somebody and you'll come up with this great way and you'll go, aha, there's the moment. And then you'll never know when the listener's gonna have the aha moment. Sometimes I was out there just planting seeds. I wanted more, the victims wanted more, they deserve more, they deserve instant veganism, but I had to remember,

Guess what? The guy that converted the most people on the planet, I didn't become an instant vegan. I was as stubborn as they came. I stopped fighting, which upsets me when I get people being defiant, but I found that that elephant in the circus was 1993 that opened my eyes. I didn't become vegan until 96. So this is also why, contrary to popular belief, why I do work so well with people.

I remember how hard it was. And once I started speaking at schools and in certain, with certain professors, I almost was always brought back to that professor's class, to that school. So I had students who sometimes had to hear me two, three, four, five, six times and they came up to me and it was like after the fourth time. Say, Gary, man, I hated you the first time. I started listening to you the second time.

And it really made sense the third time, now I'm becoming vegan. But, so the seed was planted. And I had, I mean, had hundreds of people make this conversion. It wasn't the first time. Now, I had tons of people the first time say, my God, you changed my life. Yes, this makes sense. But other people had to hear me two, three, four, five times and all of sudden it made sense. I mean, I wasn't doing an advertisement, but I guess in some way I was advertising on behalf of

of the victims? This is why on TV you have to show you the same damn commercial 50 times in one day because it has to sink in. They're trying to make it sink in. Same thing we're doing with the vegan message. You got to say it over and over and over again for as long as you can because the seed was planted the first time and now we're all just trying to get that seed to grow and to blossom and then all of sudden

Bryan (01:11:13.02)

Mm-hmm.

gary yourofsky (01:11:28.651)

boom, it clicks one day. And who knows why it clicks? It might be their own dog or their own cat that's sitting on the couch. It may be the death of their dog or their cat, a loved one. Because what a, you know, there's a great, that's a great way to honor your dog or your cat that you love so much is to become vegan and help out the other animals. It's something that when I look back, I mean, yes, the elephant opened my eyes going to the slaughterhouse and seeing the pigs being called out.

When I was fighting on behalf of the octopuses that were being thrown on the ice during the Red Wings hockey games, my hometown hockey team in 95. Those were lot, those were main things, but the relationships I had with my dog throughout my life, all my dogs, Shadow and Bourbon and Brandy, I realized, you know what? Man, why would I fight somebody to death if I had to, to protect them? And all of a sudden I'm letting people kill cows and pigs and chickens and turkeys.

How come just those dogs are my friends or just those bunny rabbits in the backyard, just the squirrels that I like to see? All animals should be my friends. And, and, and, yeah.

Bryan (01:12:36.815)

I love it. It's so spot on. You're absolutely right, Gary. mean, and you continue to help us all take a really hard look at the truth of what we're dealing with on a regular basis. I think we could probably talk for another two hours. No problem. I would love to have you back in three months, six months or whatever. We can unpack another list of topics. We'll get a whole bunch of feedback from the people watching this episode. I got one more quick rapid fire question. Hit us with

gary yourofsky (01:12:55.253)

Let's do this again, please.

Bryan (01:13:06.001)

you know, the best way to get in touch with you if they want to, and or again, Sasha Farms, tell us about that one more time. But like for the man who just listened to this whole thing right now and feels very convicted to act right now, what is the first most immediate non-negotiable action he has to take in the next 24 hours?

gary yourofsky (01:13:30.281)

I would go watch my speech. So go online, go to YouTube, enter my name and put in Georgia Tech speech. Or it's also referred to as the greatest speech ever, most important speech, something like that. Spend 70 minutes. And by the way, it's not a boring speech. My two people that I pattern my lecturing style after, Malcolm X and George Carlin. So you get a militant comedy roast. Yeah, there's going to be some hard parts.

But there's gonna be some humorous parts too, where I'm calling people out and showing people how absurd it is that they eat things that come out of hen asses, or on Thanksgiving they shove things into a turkey's ass and then all of a sudden vegans are weird. know, vegans don't eat things that come out of animal asses. Stop it already. You guys are the weird ones. Meet Darren Aguilar. So watch my speech, and if you're not gonna watch my speech, go watch Earthlings.

Watch one of those two things, because one of those two things should make sense. if it doesn't, you're going to have to look in the mirror and realize you're just a dickhead. Okay? If one of those two things should put you on the path to veganism. And then, listen, the victims want it immediately. Yes, please go vegan immediately. But if it's too overwhelming, I don't want to lose you. So get on the path. At least make Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday all vegan day.

and then next week add a fourth day, it Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, all vegan day. Keep adding a day at some point and by the end of the year, by the end of six months, boom, all of a sudden you're gonna be vegan. Start eating and by the way, eat some of that good food, eat the whole foods that we're always talking about, grains, eat barley, I do a cup of barley sometimes for breakfast, sometimes for dinner.

Keep in mind the Roman gladiators, word gladiator translates to barley eater. Don't tell me that you can't be big and bad and tough by eating all the plants out there. Look at the animal kingdom. Rhinos are vegans, hippos are vegans, elephants are vegans. The biggest, baddest animals out there are vegans. So get on the path to veganism. Start consuming all the vegan food. Start buying non-animal skin shoes, non-animal skin...

gary yourofsky (01:15:41.281)

clothing apparel because veganism isn't just about eating plant-based food is about not wearing animal skins not going to the circus to the rodeo to the zoo not supporting vivisection and animal research it's about not exploiting animals but of course the worst form of abuse happening on this planet right now is in the meat, dairy and egg industry so get the animal products out of your refrigerator and out of your bodies don't be a walking graveyard anymore

Don't be an exploiter.

Bryan (01:16:11.55)

Wow, Gary, you just continue. That's right.

gary yourofsky (01:16:13.448)

Be a real man, be a real man by the way, real men take care of those who are weaker than they are and the animals need our help, they need all the men out there to stand up on their behalf and stand for them.

Bryan (01:16:28.734)

Absolutely. Please everybody go make a donation to Sasha farms Gary. This has just been a phenomenal talk every time we ask a question you come back and just like boom the my smile gets bigger and So well said on all the stuff. Thank you very much to Justin and Bruce for popping in and helping me Talk through this all with you. There's so much to unpack And thank you very much Gary for your uncompromising honesty as always

Bruce Da Silva (01:16:29.358)

Thank you, Gary.

Bryan (01:16:58.546)

To our listeners out there, you heard the challenge. True strength is really built on truth and courage. Please help us subscribe to this podcast, share this episode and get out there and redefine your power. Real men eat plants. Thank you everybody.

gary yourofsky (01:17:17.3)

Okay.